Nathan Bond's TART Remarks

Religion: Respect? Ridicule!

Ag pleaze dêddy…

with 86 comments

Warning. LPS. Reader discretion is advised.

Angus “I-haven’t-bin-to-baaibil-college-I’ve-bin-to-agricultural-college-but-i-haven’t-bin-to-baaibil-college” Buchan will this Friday pray to God for rain in the Eastern Cape.

“Ag pleaze dêddy, wouldn’t you make it rain man, 5, 6, 7 mils, 8, 9, 10…”

I checked out the weather forecast for the region and rain is expected for today, Thursday, Sunday and Tuesday. Not much, mind, but darem, ek sê. So this might be an expedient time to do some praying for rain.

But crazy as praying for rain might be, it does afford us a clarion insight into the character of “God”. Let me elucidate…

Suppose your child is hungry. You know this because you haven’t supplied a meal for two days and she’s lethargic and queasy. You do… fuck all. So she’s hungry.

Eventually, she asks you for food. You do fuck all.

Then she organises her school mates to come serenade you. They tell you that you are just the man – you’re wise beyond comprehension; your compassion and love for your child is without a velleity of doubt and your bum makes teenage girls horny.

You supply a meal. Your child feasts. And then she gets her mates together again and they are speechless at your grace and goodness.

God is a fucking cunt. The doos should be drawn and quartered.

I mean, does this poephol not know it’s dry in Uitenhage? He should fucking get Dstv.

Written by Nathan Bond

February 4, 2009 at 19:38

86 Responses

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  1. You have to hear this chop to believe how much kak he talks. This morning’s “lesson” was about generosity and how Crushtians are often not generous. He told a story about how he and his son were on their way to Lusaka in a Toyota when they hit a dog, damaging their radiator. Apparently after the travellers had been ignored by a Crushtian, two Musdims repaired the damaged radiator and refused any payment. Bangus Buckin’ later sent them a gift. (Copies of the Holey Babble, ya thinks?)

    So let’s get this straight: Here’s this dof doos punting a Crushtian lifestyle because it’s allegedly the Only True™ approach that can lead to “salvation” (whatever the fuck that might be), but he’s helped out of his bind by a pair of heathens rather than by someone who follows his Only True™ path. “Oh, but that person wasn’t a True Crushtian™!” you say. Bullshit, judging by the prevalence of such behaviour. Still, by that yardstick those two Musdims would be True Crushtians™…

    Con-Tester

    August 28, 2011 at 08:54

  2. Ek wil net graag vir hierdie Bond mannetjie sê dat God nie met hom laat spot nie en dat hy (Bond) moet ophou om met God te spot. Hy gaan nie verewig lewe nie en as Hy nie sy saak met doe God wat hom geskep het regmaak nie voordat hy te sterwe kom wat slfs vannag of more kan gebeur gaan hy sy oë in die Hel oopmaak waar hy en sy medespotters verewig sal brand vir hul gespottery. Robby

    Robby

    October 8, 2010 at 21:52

  3. Con-Tester, weereens kon jy tot op hede, niks wat ek sogenaamd “uit wurg”, weerlê.

    Hans Matthysen

    November 30, 2009 at 20:31

  4. Frikkie, so jy verdoem die grootste deel van die wereld se mense wat moslems, hindus, ens. is – dis net die christene wat gered gaan word.

    Wie gee jou die reg om almal te verdoem. Wag, ek weet – die bybel en god. En dit maak van jou ‘n verwaande mens wat ander veroordeel uit die waan dat jy reg is.

    Ek dink nie daar is hulp vir jou nie – glo maar lekker voort wat jy glo. Vermy om te dink, en te redeneer, en wetenskaplike feite na te vors, want jou wereld is ‘n gekke droomwereld ou maat.

    screw-tin-eyes

    November 17, 2009 at 07:10

  5. Ag ja Hans, die ontsaglike “kennis” wat jy uit jou storieboek kan wurg is weereens heeltemaal duidelik.

    Con-Tester

    November 15, 2009 at 12:46

  6. Nathan, ek het versekering, ja en darom het ek ook sekerheid.

    Hans Matthysen

    November 11, 2009 at 21:58

  7. Nathan, God kies ons en nie anders om nie.

    Hans Matthysen

    November 11, 2009 at 21:55

  8. Con-tester, ek is versoen met die feit, dat my aardse bestaan tot ‘n einde gaan kom en dit blyk vir my of jy ‘n vrees het, vir die einde van jou aardse bestaan, soos jy oor die dood te kere gaan.
    Gelukkig weet ek, dat ek nie bestem is vir die ewige dood omdat ek reeds ten dele, deel is, van die ewige lewe.
    God het niks opgeneuk nie en dit is maar net jy wat nie ‘n idee het waaroor dit gaan.

    Hans Matthysen

    November 11, 2009 at 21:53

  9. Jou, uhm, redenasie oortuig my, Frikkie. Ek bibber van die vrees.

    Nou gaan lees asb. van die vorige kommentaar in hierdie draad.

    Con-Tester

    November 9, 2009 at 08:48

  10. As jy nie glo soos `n kind nie is jy reguit op pad hel toe. God laat HOM NIE BESPOT en die spotter loop skotvry weg nie. Wanneer jy dalk eendag `n wonderwerk van GOD sien en ERVAAR mag dit dalk vir ewig te laat wees.
    Omdat daar mense is wat nie aan GOD wil glo nie moet hulle aan die duiwel wat hulle vader is glo en hy is die een wat jou van GOD verwyder hou want dan kan jy nie die heerlikheid van God ervaar nie.
    Wees gewaarsku, hierdie skrywe gaan in die oordeel teen jou tel of ty dit wil glo of nie

    Frikkie

    November 7, 2009 at 20:15

  11. Jou “permanente verligting” is maar net ’n verbloeming van “vrek.” Sal jy self dalk jou “permanente verligting” verkies bo leef, Hans Matthysen? Want as jy “ja” sê kan ek jou raad bied hoe om dit te bewerkstellig.

    Het jou god dan in haar oneindige kennis en almag die eerste rondte opgeneuk sodat sy haar seuntjie (wat nou eintlik kamstig sy self was) moes stuur om die gemors reg te maak?

    Con-Tester

    May 20, 2009 at 20:26

  12. Con-tester, permanente verligting is beter as om genees te word en in baie ander opsigte te ly.
    God het juis Jesus gestuur om die wet te wysig en daarom het die een nie die ander een weerspreek nie.

    Hans Matthysen

    May 19, 2009 at 22:54

  13. “Ek weet nie waar jy aan die stelling kom nie, jy is baie duidellik nie ‘n wakker oukie nie!”

    Maar my fok. Jou maatjie Hans het dit geseg. En toe gebruik ek dit as beginpunt.

    “Ek weet nie of jy die Bybel lees of het nie, maar voor jy uitsprake oor ‘n saak lewer, moet jy tog weet waaroor die saak gaan & moet jy dus ondersoek instel”

    Jissis so ‘n skynheilige bliksem. Kyk net hoe kak ontleed hy my boodskappe.

    ” – iets wat nie een attiees wat ek al ontmoet het bereid is/was om te doen nie (of altans julle doen dit net selektief).”

    Sowaar? Ek het nog nie een slim Dopper ontmoet nie…o ja, want ek het nog nooit ENIGE Dopper ontmoet nie. Dankie Allah (vrede op Sy naam). Allah Akbar!

    En vir die res van jou treurmara voel ek niks want julle Dopper sekte is ‘n klomp KETTERS!!!! Ek luister net na wat die Heilige NG Kerk aan my vertel. So gaan blaas ‘n doppie.

    “Gee my asseblief een bewys van waar die Bybel ‘n leuen vertel en bewys dit, ek weet jy gaan tot die dag wat jy sterf soek – sterkte!”

    Hahaha. nou gaan jy afkak ou boet. Lees gerus hier:
    http://answering-islam.com/101_bible_contradictions.htm

    “Julle sal nie weer van my hoor nie”

    Wag, wat hoor ek dan nou daar? Banggat! Jy is ‘n skandelike vlek op Allah (vrede op Sy naam) se Skepping.

    Morne Alberts

    May 17, 2009 at 12:53

  14. M Alberts skryf:
    “Jesus het duidelik die stenig saak afgekeur met die nuwe verbond wat Hy daar gestel het.”

    OK, maar nou raak ek baie deurmekaar.

    jesus is god is jesus, ne? Want anders is jy ‘n heiden wat gestenig moet word.

    So jesus (god) het god (jesus) se wette afgekeur. M.a.w. god het sy eie wette afgekeur.”

    Ek weet nie waar jy aan die stelling kom nie, jy is baie duidellik nie ‘n wakker oukie nie! Ek weet nie of jy die Bybel lees of het nie, maar voor jy uitsprake oor ‘n saak lewer, moet jy tog weet waaroor die saak gaan & moet jy dus ondersoek instel – iets wat nie een attiees wat ek al ontmoet het bereid is/was om te doen nie (of altans julle doen dit net selektief).
    Dit is duidellik dat God nerens in die Bybel Sy wet ongedaan maak nie.
    Mat 7:21 – “Nie elkeen wat vir My sê: ‘Here, Here’ sal in die koningkryk van die hemel ingaan nie, maar net hy wat die wil doen van my Vader wat in die hemel is. Baie sal daardie dag vir My sê: ‘Here,Here, het ons dan nie in u Naam gepreek nie, deur u Naam bose geeste uitgedryf en deur u Naam baie wonders gedoen nie?’ Dan sal Ek openlik vir hulle sê: Ek het julle nooit geken nie. Gaan weg van My af, julle wat die wet van God oortree.'”
    Op ‘n ander plek staan daar dat nie een enkele letter van die wet sal verval nie.
    Wat het Christus dan kom doen?
    Wel, ons is sondig en kan nie die wet volkome nakom nie, maar dit is nie al waaroor dit gaan nie. Wat beteken dit om iemand te ken?… Dit is jy het ‘n verhouding met hom/haar en jy weet nie net van die persoon nie, maar ken hom/haar werklik (ek is seker ons almal weet wat die verskil is). Nou wat bedoel God dan as Hy sê: “Ek het julle nooit geken nie”?. Dit gan daaroor dat jy ‘n noue en persoonlike verhouding met Hom het. Verder… daar staan ook geskrywe dat jy jou liefde aan Hom bewys deur sy gebooie te onderhou. So hoe weet ek of ek werklik God lief het, as ek die begeerte het om Sy gebooie te onderhou en dit probeer nakom. Ja ons maak foute en doen nie als reg nie, maar te danke aan Christus sal dit nie teen my gehou word nie. Ek kan darom nie net aangaan en doen wat ek wil en soos ek goedvind nie (tensy ek God se wet goed vind), maar ons sondige natuur skop daarteen en wat my siel wil en my liggaam wil is twee verskillende dinge en dit het met die sondeval gekom. So hoe werk die verlossing ding nou?
    Ek aanvaar Christus as my verlosser en dat Hy die enigste pad is na die ewige lewe. Die gevolg is dat ek dankbaar is vir sy verlossing en uit dankbaarheid en omdat ek God liefhet probeer ek my bes om Sy gebooie te onderhou, nie omdat dit my gaan red nie, maar omdat ek Hom liefhet en Hom ken en sy verlossing deur Christus aanvaar. Daaruit volg dat ek ‘n verhouding met Hom moet hê sodat ek Hom kan ken en Sy wil vir my lewe. Dus wil God hê ons moet ‘n verhouding met Hom hê. Daarmee kom ‘n tweede vraag: wat is die waarheid?
    Wel daar is verskillende waarhede, die een is ‘n algemene waarheid (bv Mandela was in die tronk, dit is die waarheid en was werklik so, dis ‘n feit). Die ander een is van toepassing op ons elkeen persoonlik en gaan oor hoe jy jou lewe leef. As ek sê dat ek glo dat Christus vir my sonde gesterf het dan is dit ‘n waarheid wat ek skeinbaar glo, maar as ek terselfde tyd die wet wil onderhou met die gedagte dat ek hel toe gaan as ek nie die wet volkome onderhou nie, dan aanvaar ek nie werklik dat Christus vir my sonde gesterf het nie en is dit nie werlkik die waarhied in my lewe nie. Iemand gee dalk voor hy/sy is eerlik, maar die persoon se lewe getuig dit nie. Dus vir my en jou om te weet wat in ons lewens die waarheid is moet ons kyk na ons lewens. Dit beteken nie dat as my lewe een waarhied getuig dat dit die waarheid vir almal is nie. Nou wat is die waarheid van jou? Glo jy of nie en watokal jy glo, leef jy daarvolgens?
    Ek sê dit weer en vir die laaste keer: Moenie die Bybel aanvat en sê dit is ‘n klomp bog as jy nie eers ondersoek ingestel het nie (jy is dan onnosel, naiev en het nie die vermoe om ‘n ingeligte belsuit te maak nie). Anders los dit net eerder uit en gaan aan met jou lewe, sê niks want eintlik weet jy niks! Gee my asseblief een bewys van waar die Bybel ‘n leuen vertel en bewys dit, ek weet jy gaan tot die dag wat jy sterf soek – sterkte!
    Verder… noem asseblief vir my een ding wat sleg is van God se gebooie, daar is nie een, een enkele gebod wat sleg is vir ons nie, elkeen is goed vir ons en dit is die afwyking daarvan wat chaos veroorsaak. God is vol liefde, wat is fout of sleg daarmee, wil julle hê ons moet mekaar haat? As jy God se gebooie slegpraat dan praat jy ook teen die liefde – gaan dan maar aan met jul liefdelose lewens vol haat en weereens sterkte! Ek weet wat die waarheid is en julle het ook ‘n keuse.
    Julle sal nie weer van my hoor nie en julle sal ook nooit kan sê julle het nie geweet van Christus en God nie, julle sal nie kan sê julle het nie ‘n keuse gehad nie en met julle lewens getuig julle teen God, dit is die waarheid (ek hoop dit sal eendag verander)! Los dan nou maar die saak daar en laat die wat glo, glo. Moet tog nie stry oor iets waarmee julle niks te doen wil hê nie.

    dopper student

    May 16, 2009 at 15:31

  15. Hans Matthysen skryf (Mei 4, 2009 om 10:40 nm):

    Jesus en sy groep was maar heelwat in die minderheid.

    Ja, ek weet dat jy dink dat jy meer oor jou aaklige seuntjie-god weet as meeste ander mense, maar jy jok vreeslik.

    Hans Matthysen skryf (Mei 4, 2009 om 10:40 nm):

    Ek het beslis geen storie daaruit gepers.

    Gaan lees weer wat jy geskryf het want jy jok vreeslik.

    Hans Matthysen skryf (Mei 4, 2009 om 10:40 nm):

    Met hul swak lewensomstandighede, is dit beter, dat my “hemel-pappa”, hulle, na Homself toe neem.

    M.a.w. dit is, volgens jou, beter dat die vigs-wesies moet sterf as dat jou hemel-pappa verligting vir hulle moet bewerkstellig. Jy’s ’n lekker ou seuntjie-god volgeling, al jok jy so vreeslik.

    Hans Matthysen skryf (Mei 4, 2009 om 10:40 nm):

    Net omdat jy ‘n gebrek het aan ‘n sekere kennis, wil jy nou reken, dat ek die woord kennis, misbruik. Dit wil voorkom of jy dink, jy is die alfa en omega.

    Dit wil net vir jou so voorkom want jy weet duidelik nie wat “kennis” beteken nie. Dit is hoofsaaklik die gevolg van so baie vreeslike jok.

    Hans Matthysen skryf (Mei 4, 2009 om 10:40 nm):

    Wat die Bybel en Goddelikheid betref, is dit duidelik dat jy nie jou brein behoorlik inspan en jy nodig het om op jouself te trap.

    Maar dit is dan ’n groot klomp vreeslike jok-stories.

    Hans Matthysen skryf (Mei 4, 2009 om 10:40 nm):

    Jesus het duidelik die stenig saak afgekeur met die nuwe verbond wat Hy daar gestel het. Jy weet blykbaar nie veel wat Jesus verkondig het.

    So seuntjie-god weerspreek pappa-god (al is hulle een) en jy jok om hulle jokkery weg te steek. Wie jok nou eintlik?

    Con-Tester

    May 5, 2009 at 10:06

  16. Jesus het duidelik die stenig saak afgekeur met die nuwe verbond wat Hy daar gestel het.

    OK, maar nou raak ek baie deurmekaar.

    jesus is god is jesus, ne? Want anders is jy ‘n heiden wat gestenig moet word.

    So jesus (god) het god (jesus) se wette afgekeur. M.a.w. god het sy eie wette afgekeur.
    M.a.w. god erken dat sy wette sleg is.
    M.a.w. god is gedeeltelik sleg.
    Halleluja. Hoe onbeskryfbaar groot is sy onbegrypbare wee.

    Morne Alberts

    May 5, 2009 at 09:03

  17. Con-tester, (April 18, 2009 at 12:46 am)

    Jesus en sy groep was maar heelwat in die minderheid.

    Ek het beslis geen storie daaruit gepers.

    Met hul swak lewensomstandighede, is dit beter, dat my “hemel-pappa”, hulle, na Homself toe neem.

    Net omdat jy ‘n gebrek het aan ‘n sekere kennis, wil jy nou reken, dat ek die woord kennis, misbruik. Dit wil voorkom of jy dink, jy is die alfa en omega.

    Wat die Bybel en Goddelikheid betref, is dit duidelik dat jy nie jou brein behoorlik inspan en jy nodig het om op jouself te trap.

    Jesus het duidelik die stenig saak afgekeur met die nuwe verbond wat Hy daar gestel het. Jy weet blykbaar nie veel wat Jesus verkondig het.

    Hans Matthysen

    May 4, 2009 at 22:40

  18. DW (April 17, 2009 at 6:57 pm) Ek glo nie in kak nie. Jy sien dit net as kak, want die kak is in jou oog.

    Hans Matthysen

    May 4, 2009 at 22:11

  19. OK John, so you’re a vampire in some incestuous blood cult. You warn me against quoting verses without context, what is it that you are doing? And I always thought this blood cult was about worshipping one bloodthirsty being, but now I see that jesus sits separately from yahweh, which makes it clear that jesus isn’t yahweh which means you’re a polytheist. Which, if I’m not mistaken, is punishable by stoning.

    Why don’t you also explain to me where satan came from. The full genealogy, mind you. And then also explain to me where evil happened to pop up along the way – the evil that made satan evil before the earth existed.

    And then you complain about how we try to give religion a bad name? HAH. Look at how various religions are constantly disputing/denying the findings of science. For example, look at the websites set up by fundamentalists who say that man lived alongside dinosaurs.

    We are fighting irrationality in all its forms. Religion (and in South Africa christianity) is the biggest irrational institution. You cannot prove to us that religion is rational, and you never will, and therefore we will never stop.

    Morne Alberts

    May 4, 2009 at 09:18

  20. The coattail-riders crawl out of the woodwork. Sometimes out of the filmwork, too.

    Con-Tester

    May 4, 2009 at 08:41

  21. All believers,

    I will endeavour to be considerably more succinct than John above (May 4, 2009 at 5:29 am).

    Citing bible verses proves only that you can cite bible verses. Your argument that goes, “The bible proves god, god proves the bible” is a sad little joke that only satisfies those who already believe as you do.

    Learn a thing or two about what constitutes “evidence.” Learn a thing or two about “burden of proof.” Learn a thing or two about “intellectual honesty.” Then maybe one day I’ll start taking you a bit more seriously, and stop laughing and poking fun at your preposterous absurdities.

    That’s all, really.

    Con-Tester

    May 4, 2009 at 08:34

  22. All athiests
    That is why I am so glad that I am not living in the Old Testament times. Life is in the blood and someone died for disobedience and sin. Nevertheless and as I have said, God is God, the great I am the maker of man and HE will certainly not be mocked. God will judge and like everywhere else and in all “religions” does the particular god’s saints fear his displeasure’s consequences.
    Psalm 2:4-6 (NKJV)
    4 He who sits in the heavens shall laugh; The Lord shall hold them in derision.
    5 Then He shall speak to them in His wrath, and distress them in His deep displeasure:
    6 “Yet I have set My King on My holy hill of Zion.”
    The Bible must be read in context, just taking snippets here and there and then dissect it and change to justify our believe and what we want it to say and ignore the rest is ludicrous and stupid.
    If all the “atheists” on this blog whom incidentally struck me to be very intelligent can use their energy in a positive and constructive way and stop trying to proof God to be a liar while He has since the beginning of time, as we know it, been the same and never promised us a smooth ride and promised us since the beginning that if we falter we will be punished, like Adam and Eve, He is the great I AM and yes. Like in Deut 28 will destroy the evildoers and has done so with the people of Sodom and Gomorra and has not exempt us or for that matter anyone else.
    The mere fact that we are still alive is because we are not living under the law anymore but by His grace for Jesus paid with His blood for our salvation and Jesus is interceding for us otherwise GOD WOULD HAVE DESTROYED US VERY LONG AGO. We are neither puppets nor Muppets and He does not interfere with our minds and choices. Not following Him is our choice but then we cannot blame Him for not protecting us, we are then under the protection of satan whom incidentally in the ONLY other force out there and his only weapon is “virtual reality” and messing with people’s minds is his ONLY modus operandi. He is a liar, murderer (so there you have it, the culprit, SATAN THE MURDERER) deceiver, he hates ALL creation because of jealousy since he has never been constructive and has never been able to build anything but just use what is good and virtually mar and use it for his purpose through his faithful followers as his hands.
    Therefore I believe that all people are in self destruct mode if we are not dwelling in the secret place of The Almighty God protected by the Blood of Jesus. Remember what I have said, not applying the blood is your choice, it is there and it is life giving and it invigorates.
    Following Jesus is hard work and it takes a man and woman with back bone to stand up for what God expects of us hence the inability and unwillingness of some to diligently follow the Lord our God.
    Not just being given over to our lusts and cravings of the flesh which is satan’s most successful weapon is impossible without God’s guidance and protection.
    Jesus came here to be a corner stone but as you will see in the next verses can be for some a cornerstone but the same stone can be a rock of offence for those who refuse to believe, in order to justify their sin. Blaming God for everything. We live in the real world and I feel I am repeating myself, which I am, BUT God intended for man to live victorious, Man fell in the Garden of Eden and in essence gave control to satan to attack and through his willing followers ridicule God and Christians and playing mind games and just repeat himself over and over “Did God really say?” “you will surely not die” this incidentally is prove that God warned about death from the very beginning, He is the same yesterday today and forever, so I do not know where the “God must just stand still and accept the ludicrous statements against Him idea came from. He kept His peace once and that was when Jesus died and will only do so at Jesus’ request where He is sitting at the right Hand of the Father interceding for YOU as speak/write having a dialog (call it whatever you like) we can interpret this as mercy just as Jesus through His infinite love expressed on the cross towards the accused next to Him. What is Jesus for you, a Cornerstone, Rock of Salvation OR a Rock of offence?
    1 Peter 2:1-8 (NKJV)
    1 Therefore, laying aside all malice, all deceit, hypocrisy, envy, and all evil speaking,
    2 as newborn babes, desire the pure milk of the word, that you may grow thereby,
    3 if indeed you have tasted that the Lord is gracious.
    4 Coming to Him as to a living stone, rejected indeed by men, but chosen by God and precious,
    5 you also, as living stones, are being built up a spiritual house, a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
    6 Therefore it is also contained in the Scripture, “Behold, I lay in Zion A chief cornerstone, elect, precious, And he who believes on Him will by no means be put to shame.”
    7 Therefore, to you who believe, He is precious; but to those who are disobedient, “The stone which the builders rejected Has become the chief cornerstone,”
    8 and “A stone of stumbling And a rock of offense.” They stumble, being disobedient to the word, to which they also were appointed.
    Although Jesus is love and intercedes for us there will come a time where mercy and grace
    Hebrews 10:26-30 (NKJV)
    26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,
    27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries.
    28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses.
    29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace?
    30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The Lord will judge His people.”
    It is so amusing how people will devote their lives to prove that the Bible is a myth like Dan Browne’s Da Vinci Code. Taking a 15th century portrait and build a whole story around that. Wonder where Da Vinci and Now Dan Browne found the irrevocable proof of the authenticity of the picture and that it is indeed a true representation of the last supper. This portrait has got so many people studying and pondering on the posture and body language of Jesus, the twelve there and weather Jesus was married or had an extramarital affair.
    For goodness sake have the people not got something to go and do to add some value to their lives and those around them for the here and now. Some adult folks became extreme wealthy from this fairy tale though. Maybe they discovered the quick way to extreme wealth through the vulnerability and willingness to join the rumor mill enterprise which has only one guarantee and that is destruction with no value and brings in no revenue. “Some song I heard” and actually buy the nonsense.
    Makes one wonder why Christianity is the only religion that is attacked to this degree. I have not really looked but I did not see any other blog trying to proof any other religion wrong. Is it maybe that satan is not too worried about them but has his hands full with the Christians. Might it be that satan is sooo scared that he will have one less soul to torture in the hereafter.
    We are fortunate that Jesus died for our sins and that we do not have to pay the price anymore because the price has been paid by JESUS. The questions and statements asked here on this blog is exactly the reason that God gave His Son to die for us because we would not have made it otherwise.
    Now we can just accept the forgiveness for our sins and the precious Blood of Jesus guarantees us and everlasting life.
    I am sorry but the absurdities uttered about the state of heaven I am not even going to answer.
    My dear …….. whatever you want to call yourself because friend is offensive, Atheists maybe, you all know the truth, that is evident, but this dialog WILL resound in your ears one day, Nathan Hell might be the worst decision you will ever make, and to all of you here I have answered and hope I have not “dodged” or were stupid or ahs been a potato head, or Kool kop or whatever you want to call me is fine.
    The choice is yours.
    The one thing no one can argue about as my personal life experience with God through Jesus Christ. As I have said am I a skeptic about things but I have tasted His goodness and will not exchange it for anything.

    John

    May 4, 2009 at 05:29

  23. Nathan Bond

    May 2, 2009 at 19:42

  24. You, like Abraham (or whichever permutation thereof), would kill your son, possibly causing him immense pain, just because god asked you to in order to ensure your seat in heaven?

    That brings me to another question: what will heaven be like/what is heaven?
    I am fully aware that the bible states that it will be non-material, that there will be no suffering, that we won’t have bodies, etc. Now after considering all the things that heaven is not it becomes apparent that this heaven is the same as the cessation of all perceptions in your mind during biological death.

    * If heaven is a state of permanent bliss then you will not know any other state except bliss. In other words, you cannot differentiate your current state of happiness from any other state.
    * If hell is a state of permanent suffering then you will not know any other state except suffering. In other words, you cannot differentiate your current state of happiness from any other state.
    * In death you have no state. In other words, you cannot differentiate your current (non-)state of happiness from any other state.

    What is heaven? Why are you so keen to go there?

    Morne Alberts

    May 2, 2009 at 17:26

  25. Nope probably not

    So in other words, you are saying:
    “No. I would have defied god’s laws”
    i.e. “I do not agree with god’s idea of good/moral behaviour”
    i.e. “At some point during god’s existence he has shown questionable judgement.”
    i.e. “god is not all good”
    i.e. “god is partly evil”
    Is that the god you serve?

    malberts

    May 2, 2009 at 17:06

  26. Con-Tester,
    “Friend” just a old habit, I have got many friends because I do not know of any enemies, I refuse to take offence and if I do I get rid of it very quick because it distracts my mind of what I am supposed to think about and my goals in life and No ……….. It is not all religion related. And people have got the right to their own opionions.
    I will answer you in detail but my daughter is getting married today so I jsut do not have the time. It might only be next week.
    In the mean time can you maybe comment on some of the other points I mentioned and you accidentally missed.

    John

    May 2, 2009 at 09:20

  27. Morne, Nope probably not, but I did not live in the BC ages, I was fortunate to be borne in the age where Jesus already died and now living by His grace.

    John

    May 2, 2009 at 09:06

  28. John wrote (May 1, 2009 at 1:31 pm):

    Now how is it that you accuse a God “that does not exist for you” for traumatic events on earth?

    It’s called “reductio ad absurdum,” a mode of argument that apparently flies way above the heads of religious believers. I surmise that the latter has much to do with believers being so well accustomed to holding onto absurdities and not being in any way disturbed by them.

    John wrote (May 1, 2009 at 1:31 pm):

    Name calling [sic] is anyway a sign of defeat.

    Try “exasperation.” It’s a little closer to the truth.

    John wrote (May 1, 2009 at 1:31 pm):

    [S]tubborn rebellious people will NEVER taste the goodness of being in and under authority.

    And there you have pinpointed the crux of religious subservience: It’s all about believers wanting there to be some authority that’ll cosset them through the trials and tribulations of their lives because being their own sovereign individuals is just too scary for them. So they perpetuate the myth – just like some people never outgrow clinging to their parents, the believer cannot dispense with the thought that there’s an Überdaddy up there looking out for them.

    And please stop referring to me as “my friend” because (a) I do not know you except as a name and a bunch of words on a blog, and (b) in doing so, you come across as unctuous which doesn’t sit very well with me.

    I do not want your god’s healing. I wouldn’t trust him/her to heal a broken fingernail. You’ll probably get cancer from his/her ministrations. No, I want to know why so many people are so easily deceived by an obvious fairytale. Now, perhaps you should actually answer my questions instead of again attempting to dodge them with irrelevancies, obfuscation, verbiage, further absurdities, unsubstantiated presuppositions and transparent deflections. According to your own rules, all of humanity consists of your god’s people. Moreover, s/he made them and s/he decides their fate, so why is s/he killing them, especially the very youngest and most innocent ones (still in the womb, nogal!) who haven’t even had a chance to sin yet?

    Con-Tester

    May 1, 2009 at 15:30

  29. John, answer me a simple question: would you have stoned your children according to the old testament if you lived during that time?

    Morne Alberts

    May 1, 2009 at 15:06

  30. John

    You are most welcome to publish your contact details on this blog. Alternatively you can instruct me to forward your details to Con-Tester or anyone else participating on this blog. I will, however, not disclose a third party’s details without explicit permission.

    NB

    Nathan Bond

    May 1, 2009 at 14:00

  31. Ha ha Nathan, Comprehensive insurance huh, ek dink dit kan ook nogal interesant wees om met jou te praat oor iets anders as Godsdiens ook.

    John

    May 1, 2009 at 13:44

  32. Good morning Con-Tester,
    My sincere apologies about pointing out a serious and unfortunate consequence by not following the Biblical suggestion that one should not fornicate and from there mans solution by murdering unborn children and cause them to die and excruciating death because of aids.
    I am also confused, as I understood it are you an atheist, right? Now how is it that you accuse a God “that does not exist for you” for traumatic events on earth? I just wondered.
    But ok let’s talk about miscarriages; this is for sure one of the most traumatic situations one can find them-selves in. Personally I am extremely grateful towards the creator of heaven and earth that I was spared not to go through anything like that.
    My question to you, since you have got all the statistics handy, is. How many of these parents were Christians? And how many claimed to be Christians but did not diligently follow the voice and instruction of God. If not, do you think they were under the protection of God?
    Furthermore, let us first establish where you think for instance, you came from? And how did man come into being/existence in the first place.
    I unfortunately do not have the statistics and would appreciate it if you can forward it to me. This is now about the natural disasters but to my knowledge did the most devastating disasters occur in the predominantly Muslim countries and from there my statement non “Christian Countries”.
    Followers of all the various religions actually fear their gods, the Greeks actually fear their gods, and they have their god of war, warfare, love, merriment and a host of other gods. The same with various other religions. The Muslims are extremely diligent in worshipping, who do they blame for their problems and traumas?
    May I reiterate my statement and just for the record my friend, I do not hide nor do I dodge questions. God is a God of love, He is the great I am, He the Alpha and Omega, He is the Life giver, He is the Creator of the heavens and the earth, He is our Provider, He is our Healer, He is our Peace, He is our Sanctifier, He is your Maker too.
    He is also our Judge, and like in EVERY OTHER religion their deity punished the unfaithful followers. God creates and it is up to Him to take again. Our primary purpose on earth is to worship Him. That my friend does not mean that we do not have fun, I have a lot of fun, I go boating, I aviate, I do more than the average person but I do not consume intoxicating substances and I do not allow my fun to own me, I do not cheat or corrupt, I do not lie, I manage my own successful business and I try to live my life in a way that I assume the position as leader and lead the way for my children and friends, business partners and just onlookers to watch and stand strong in difficult situations and even traumas. People associating with me know they can trust my word. I am not scared to admit when I am wrong and hey that is quite often and do not say I was the perfect person my whole life long but what I can say is that since Jesus became part of my life it changed and I experienced His goodness. As an intelligent person I can tell you that skepticism was part of my design but I allowed God into my everyday life and I certainly can say that I am glad I did. It changed my self-control and demeanor and the harmony I have with people around me is a composition I will not give up.
    At first it was difficult but as I diligently studied the word of God I found out that what my parents taught me was true and the fact that we were held responsible for our actions as kids and that self-pity was not allowed at all as we were growing up is a major factor of where I stand today. We were taught from and very early age to take responsibility for our actions and ultimately the consequences thereof. That is why I do not blame anyone for my difficulties and traumas and if I fall I stand up and carry on. And No Con-Tester I am not a koolkop, idiot or potatoehead. Name calling is anyway a sign of defeat.
    I cannot do this without God. That fact is undeniably essential for our everyday walk through life. Man messed up in the Garden of Eden and was demoted from King and Queen to the farmer and his wife and ever since then, man placed him self in an imperfect world. God had other intentions for us but the one thing He does not intervene in is our freedom of choice. He is not harboring puppets but His is simultaneously not a wimp. He has got the right to punish and/or destroy anyone.
    Someone mentioned Elijah the Hebrew prophet here on the blog; well what happened with the priests of Baal, God destroyed them with fire. We have the choice. Why must He sit and watch idolatry and paganism now? Worship Jehovah.
    Punishment my friend is normally giving someone the chance to revert from wrong doing and get back on track. This is for most people a wakeup call (and no I am not talking about miscarriages) but the stubborn rebellious people will NEVER taste the goodness of being in and under authority. This does not only equate to the Christian believe but in all areas of our lives.
    We can however opt to move out from under Gods protection, that is when satan get’s hold of you and cause all the damage possible. It is also his intention to cause as much havoc, trauma, hurt and drama in the people he is able to intimidate and the only way he can accomplish it is by messing with our minds, because he can only send you on your way by setting up a series of devastating events and man will destroy himself. In itself satan is teeth less and is blowing smoke by billowing a situation out of proportion and out of fear man will react favorably for his purpose and he will ride the situation till he got his will. My friend do not blame God for miscarriages, never doubt His goodness and good intention and love for all.
    God is not running around like a sheepdog gathering the herd and preventing us to not get hurt, if we deliberately drive over a stop sign crossing, by not obeying the stop you might or might not get hurt of get a fine, the stop is there for our protection, it is our choice to use or ignore it, the consequences can be quite severe, God placed all we need at our disposal and what we do with it is our choice, the consequences can also be quite severe.
    Nowhere in the Bible were we promised a trouble free and smooth ride, all He promised the faithful believer and follower of Jesus is that Jesus will be in the boat with us and handle the situation.
    I however perceive you know more about the Bible than what you are willing to admit. What ever happened in your past is not too big for God to heal. Let’s start at the beginning, at the basics and maybe you can be freed from this intense hatred towards God. I urge you to reconsider and would welcome a man to man talk with you. I am not pushy but I would love to chat with you in person over a cup of tea in a public place.
    I have never communicated on any blog so I am not sure how to get my cell phone number or email address to you. I understand we are not allowed to publish it here.
    Please do not let this communication resound in your ears after it is to late my friend. Because it WILL.
    THE CHOICE IS YOURS CON-TESTER

    John

    May 1, 2009 at 13:31

  33. John, your reply of April 30, 2009 at 1:28 pm indicates only one thing, namely that you haven’t understood my questions and observations at all, or that you’re dodging them. In addition, you are either deluded or lying through your teeth when you claim that “the countries that were most effected [sic] [by natural disasters] is [sic] against [my god] and even declared war against His followers.” Show me the statistics from a credible source to support this rather remarkable contention.

    As far as the abortion and infant question is concerned, I never said a thing about “[p]eople fornicate, sin and rape and then deliberately go for abortions.” Nor did I speak about “aids infected infants,” so you’ve made a bunch of things up out of thin air. However, your answers – that these are sins, variously your god’s punishment – are revealing. Here are the facts again: your skydaddy gratuitously aborts thirty-plus million human foetuses every year in the form of miscarriages. I am not talking about abortions carried out by people. I am talking about miscarriages that are in most cases a source of great distress to the expectant parents, particularly the mother. In regard to the infant deaths, these too are just as entirely random as the miscarriages, meaning that these sad events befall people irrespective of the particular faith they belong to.

    Now, is your god testing these people or is he punishing them for something? Because neither option is morally defensible.

    If for the sake of argument one assumes the existence of your omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, omnibenevolent, uncaused first-cause personal creator-god, whatever happens, it’s ultimately your god’s doing. It cannot logically be otherwise.

    Con-Tester

    April 30, 2009 at 17:59

  34. Gelowiges wat nie vir Jesus erken nie? nee wat jy tas in die duister en die vraag is vanselfsprekend.
    ek is seker julle ouens het niks om te doen nie en nou soek julle iets om oor te praat.
    Genade ou, wat pla die Dr Burger jou so, jy weet om die mens aan te val is ‘n teken van hopelose magteloosheid. ondat jy geen grond het vir jou stellings nie en no kraak jy maar die persoon af.
    Hoe stry jy dan so wanhopig, het een van die persone jou tenagekom, beroof of dalk gevloek, SKULD EEN VAN HULLE JOU IETS of voel jy dalk skuldig oor iets was jy dalk voorheen gehad het maar laat vaar het.
    As jy so sterk voel oor die manne, stop om na alles te luister en na te vors wat hulle se, skryf and publiseer. jy kan dalk net langer lewe man. JOINING THE RUMERMILL YOU ONLY NEED A MOUTH AND TWO BIG EARS, there is one in every town, and the only guarantee is distruction. (FROM A SONG I HEARD SOMEWHERE).
    joe manne ek het nie geweet daar is regtig mense met soveel haat en neid in hulle nie, julle ouens het hulp nodig man.
    Gaan aan met julle lewe en los die tydmorsery om mense af te kraak wat in elk geval nie kan omgee wat julle DINK DOEN OF se nie. Kom ons praat oor vliegtuie of iets dergeliks, sien hier is een ou wat praat van ‘n BARON, SOEK IEMAND ‘N FLIP IN EEN, EK KAN DALK REEL. Dalk is dit wat julle nodig het. iemand hier met ‘n twin rating?

    John

    April 30, 2009 at 15:40

  35. Hi Con–Tester,
    No, if you becaome a Christian today, all the promises are immediately yours as well. you cannot earn salvation it is a given, it was obtained for you too on the cross when Jesus died. You must just accept it otherwise it is ueseless for you.

    How can life experiences be fraught my friend, show me the errors and omissions. my statements are undeniable because I have experienced the goodness of God and there is NO gain for me in any way to promulgate these things here.

    Now how do you associate abortion as a act of God? People fornicate, sin and rape and then deliberately go for abortions because they cowardly suck and dive their responsibility to stand proxy for their deeds.
    Natural disasters are acts of God so was the floods in Noah’s time. I am amazed that God is so infinitely patient and graceful towards us seen in the light of what is said on this blog alone. I am amazed that you mention these disasters because the countries that were most effected is against Him and even declared war against His followers.
    As I have mentioned earlier that human beings are responsible for their own dilemmas and if someone that is in the Christian faith dies it is not God forsaking them, you and me are also going to die and like in the animal kingdom will nature follow it course, we are not sure when, where and how but one fact is so, we will die. So whichever way He chooses is fine with me.
    The aids infected infants is a result of the infidelity of their parents and the consequences of their disobedience to God. we all bear the consequences of our actions, weather good or bad and I am sorry I cannot see how we can blame God for things we cause.
    It seems to me that we have to give God the blame for all the bad things but we do not want to give Him honor for the good things.
    He placed all good things at our disposal; the choice will remain our own to either accept or reject it. But either way will bare the consequences.
    Deuteronomy 28 will tell you in detail what God wants from us. So He is leaving no one in the dark, read the handbook of life and maybe you will understand. Or is it a case of “when everything else fails”. Do you have a Bible, if not here is Deut 28
    Deuteronomy 28:1-68 (NKJV)
    1 “Now it shall come to pass, if you diligently obey the voice of the Lord your God, to observe carefully all His commandments which I command you today, that the Lord your God will set you high above all nations of the earth.
    2 And all these blessings shall come upon you and overtake you, because you obey the voice of the Lord your God:
    3 “Blessed shall you be in the city, and blessed shall you be in the country.
    4 “Blessed shall be the fruit of your body, the produce of your ground and the increase of your herds, the increase of your cattle and the offspring of your flocks.
    5 “Blessed shall be your basket and your kneading bowl.
    6 “Blessed shall you be when you come in, and blessed shall you be when you go out.
    7 “The Lord will cause your enemies who rise against you to be defeated before your face; they shall come out against you one way and flee before you seven ways.
    8 “The Lord will command the blessing on you in your storehouses and in all to which you set your hand, and He will bless you in the land which the Lord your God is giving you.
    9 “The Lord will establish you as a holy people to Himself, just as He has sworn to you, if you keep the commandments of the Lord your God and walk in His ways.
    10 Then all peoples of the earth shall see that you are called by the name of the Lord, and they shall be afraid of you.
    11 And the Lord will grant you plenty of goods, in the fruit of your body, in the increase of your livestock, and in the produce of your ground, in the land of which the Lord swore to your fathers to give you.
    12 The Lord will open to you His good treasure, the heavens, to give the rain to your land in its season, and to bless all the work of your hand. You shall lend to many nations, but you shall not borrow.
    13 And the Lord will make you the head and not the tail; you shall be above only, and not be beneath, if you heed the commandments of the Lord your God, which I command you today, and are careful to observe them.
    14 So you shall not turn aside from any of the words which I command you this day, to the right or the left, to go after other gods to serve them.
    Curses;
    15 “But it shall come to pass, if you do not obey the voice of the Lord your God, to observe carefully all His commandments and His statutes which I command you today, that all these curses will come upon you and overtake you:
    16 “Cursed shall you be in the city, and cursed shall you be in the country.
    17 “Cursed shall be your basket and your kneading bowl.
    18 “Cursed shall be the fruit of your body and the produce of your land, the increase of your cattle and the offspring of your flocks.
    19 “Cursed shall you be when you come in, and cursed shall you be when you go out.
    20 “The Lord will send on you cursing, confusion, and rebuke in all that you set your hand to do, until you are destroyed and until you perish quickly, because of the wickedness of your doings in which you have forsaken Me.
    21 The Lord will make the plague cling to you until He has consumed you from the land which you are going to possess.
    22 The Lord will strike you with consumption, with fever, with inflammation, with severe burning fever, with the sword, with scorching, and with mildew; they shall pursue you until you perish.
    23 And your heavens which are over your head shall be bronze, and the earth which is under you shall be iron.
    24 The Lord will change the rain of your land to powder and dust; from the heaven it shall come down on you until you are destroyed.
    25 “The Lord will cause you to be defeated before your enemies; you shall go out one way against them and flee seven ways before them; and you shall become troublesome to all the kingdoms of the earth.
    26 Your carcasses shall be food for all the birds of the air and the beasts of the earth, and no one shall frighten them away.
    27 The Lord will strike you with the boils of Egypt, with tumors, with the scab, and with the itch, from which you cannot be healed.
    28 The Lord will strike you with madness and blindness and confusion of heart.
    29 And you shall grope at noonday, as a blind man gropes in darkness; you shall not prosper in your ways; you shall be only oppressed and plundered continually, and no one shall save you.
    30 “You shall betroth a wife, but another man shall lie with her; you shall build a house, but you shall not dwell in it; you shall plant a vineyard, but shall not gather its grapes.
    31 Your ox shall be slaughtered before your eyes, but you shall not eat of it; your donkey shall be violently taken away from before you, and shall not be restored to you; your sheep shall be given to your enemies, and you shall have no one to rescue them.
    32 Your sons and your daughters shall be given to another people, and your eyes shall look and fail with longing for them all day long; and there shall be no strength in your hand.
    33 A nation whom you have not known shall eat the fruit of your land and the produce of your labor, and you shall be only oppressed and crushed continually.
    34 So you shall be driven mad because of the sight which your eyes see.
    35 The Lord will strike you in the knees and on the legs with severe boils which cannot be healed, and from the sole of your foot to the top of your head.
    36 “The Lord will bring you and the king whom you set over you to a nation which neither you nor your fathers have known, and there you shall serve other gods—wood and stone.
    37 And you shall become astonishment, a proverb, and a byword among all nations where the Lord will drive you.
    38 “You shall carry much seed out to the field but gather little in, for the locust shall consume it.
    39 You shall plant vineyards and tend them, but you shall neither drink of the wine nor gather the grapes; for the worms shall eat them.
    40 You shall have olive trees throughout all your territory, but you shall not anoint yourself with the oil; for your olives shall drop off.
    41 You shall beget sons and daughters, but they shall not be yours; for they shall go into captivity.
    42 Locusts shall consume all your trees and the produce of your land.
    43 “The alien who is among you shall rise higher and higher above you, and you shall come down lower and lower.
    44 He shall lend to you, but you shall not lend to him; he shall be the head, and you shall be the tail.
    45 “Moreover all these curses shall come upon you and pursue and overtake you, until you are destroyed, because you did not obey the voice of the Lord your God, to keep His commandments and His statutes which He commanded you.
    46 And they shall be upon you for a sign and a wonder, and on your descendants forever.
    47 “Because you did not serve the Lord your God with joy and gladness of heart, for the abundance of everything,
    48 therefore you shall serve your enemies, whom the Lord will send against you, in hunger, in thirst, in nakedness, and in need of everything; and He will put a yoke of iron on your neck until He has destroyed you.
    49 The Lord will bring a nation against you from afar, from the end of the earth, as swift as the eagle flies, a nation whose language you will not understand,
    50 a nation of fierce countenance, which does not respect the elderly nor show favor to the young.
    51 And they shall eat the increase of your livestock and the produce of your land, until you are destroyed; they shall not leave you grain or new wine or oil, or the increase of your cattle or the offspring of your flocks, until they have destroyed you.
    52 “They shall besiege you at all your gates until your high and fortified walls, in which you trust, come down throughout all your land; and they shall besiege you at all your gates throughout all your land which the Lord your God has given you.
    53 You shall eat the fruit of your own body, the flesh of your sons and your daughters whom the Lord your God has given you, in the siege and desperate straits in which your enemy shall distress you.
    54 The sensitive and very refined man among you will be hostile toward his brother, toward the wife of his bosom, and toward the rest of his children whom he leaves behind,
    55 so that he will not give any of them the flesh of his children whom he will eat, because he has nothing left in the siege and desperate straits in which your enemy shall distress you at all your gates.
    56 The tender and delicate woman among you, who would not venture to set the sole of her foot on the ground because of her delicateness and sensitivity, will refuse to the husband of her bosom, and to her son and her daughter,
    57 her placenta which comes out from between her feet and her children whom she bears; for she will eat them secretly for lack of everything in the siege and desperate straits in which your enemy shall distress you at all your gates.
    58 “If you do not carefully observe all the words of this law that are written in this book, that you may fear this glorious and awesome name, THE LORD YOUR GOD,
    59 then the Lord will bring upon you and your descendants extraordinary plagues—great and prolonged plagues—and serious and prolonged sicknesses.
    60 Moreover He will bring back on you all the diseases of Egypt, of which you were afraid, and they shall cling to you.
    61 Also every sickness and every plague, which is not written in this Book of the Law, will the Lord bring upon you until you are destroyed.
    62 You shall be left few in number, whereas you were as the stars of heaven in multitude, because you would not obey the voice of the Lord your God.
    63 And it shall be, that just as the Lord rejoiced over you to do you good and multiply you, so the Lord will rejoice over you to destroy you and bring you to nothing; and you shall be plucked from off the land which you go to possess.
    64 “Then the Lord will scatter you among all peoples, from one end of the earth to the other, and there you shall serve other gods, which neither you nor your fathers have known—wood and stone.
    65 And among those nations you shall find no rest, nor shall the sole of your foot have a resting place; but there the Lord will give you a trembling heart, failing eyes, and anguish of soul.
    66 Your life shall hang in doubt before you; you shall fear day and night, and have no assurance of life.
    67 In the morning you shall say, ‘Oh that it were evening!’ And at evening you shall say, ‘Oh, that it were morning!’ because of the fear which terrifies your heart, and because of the sight which your eyes see.
    68 “And the Lord will take you back to Egypt in ships, by the way of which I said to you, ‘You shall never see it again.’ And there you shall be offered for sale to your enemies as male and female slaves, but no one will buy you.”
    So my friend what will it be, God is a God of love, he gave us the choice, why must he protect someone that rejects him right out but thank GOD FOR Jesus, His blood cleans us from our sins.
    God is love and He is waiting for you too.
    I am 100% sure that this blog will be remembered by many of the readers here but maybe it will be to late for them, they then chose to follow and is them with the GOD THEY CHOSE TO SERVE HERE ON EARTH.
    You still have a choice. God is love but if you reject Him He WILL JUDGE YOU.
    So it is not fear, it is reality. it is truth. this “conversation will be remembered by you in future” please make it a delightful thought.

    John

    April 30, 2009 at 13:28

  36. Hallo DW,
    Bly om te sien jy ken die Bybel, Elia was ‘n Godsman ne. Alle predikante is nie bulshitters nie, DW, Wat van Billy Graham?

    John

    April 30, 2009 at 12:39

  37. Ek antwoord graag,
    Ons Christene leef in die regte wereld net soos al die ander mense wat in ander gelowe glo of selfs die wat se hulle glo in geen mag of God/god nie.
    die realiteit is dat ongeag van ons geloofs stand gaan ALMAL een of ander tyd dood. sommige jonk en sommige ouer. Mense maak foute en kom dinge oor. Ek het onlangs hoe ‘n baie goeie vriend van my gekaap was en 10keer geskiet was and sy vrou 6 keer, dis realiteit, Maar Rick alhoewel die medisie hom geen kans op herstel gegee het nie was hy die naweek saam met my by MMC en sy vrou het ook herstel en die lewe gaan aan.
    We are certainly not super human beings and nowhere in the Bible is it written that Christians are exempt from real life dramas. What it promises Christians is that in
    Psalm 23:4 (NKJV)
    4 Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil; For You are with me; Your rod and Your staff, they comfort me.

    See Rick, riding a bike and falling off is the process of learning to ride the bike, having some difficulties in life is the growth process and from experience I can tell you that I handle difficulties in a much different way that what I did before. I trust God Rick, I experienced His protection in more ways than one. I certainly do not want to live the puppet way people perceive Christianity is supposed to work. God strengthens us in time of trouble; He is our foundation where we can build our lives on.
    You ask “Would something have gone wrong if I hadn’t pray? I honestly do not know, all I know is that I certainly am not going to take the chance. No skin of my back by trusting in God. There is a lot less drama in Christianity than other religions. God gave me a great wife and beautiful kids and I am responsible to lead the way in way they can follow and they certainly do, remember I did not say they are angels, but they walk the walk. They also do not live their live “ala john” they have room to develop their own personalities and they certainly make their own decisions, I just watch and they certainly watch me and through the victories I had is following the example. I ALSO DO NOT WANT TO RAISE PUPPETS.
    The question remains, why everyone is attacking the Christian Faith. Remember Rick you are not a Christian if you grew up in a Christian home or if you just believe in God. You are only a Christian once you accepted that Jesus died for your sins and believe He is the only door to the Father.
    Rick I have experienced God’s goodness and I do not doubt his intensions in any way. I do not tell you about anything I heard, I experienced it, so for me to say this and you do not believe me will equate to me lying to you or I am stupid and I can assure you it is neither of the two. It is the truth.
    I am certain GOD LIVES AND HE LOVE US, YOU TO, RICK
    BUT THE CHOICE REMAINS YOUR OWN
    HAVE A NICE DAY

    John

    April 30, 2009 at 10:10

  38. John wrote (April 30, 2009 at 5:50 am):

    We cause our own difficulties, aids (the atheists like to use to prove God is not love) stop fornicating and being adulterers and aids will stop and so is various other difficulties and calamities.

    Tell me, John, does this also apply to natural disasters like earthquakes, floods, crop blights, tsunamis, etc.? Does it also apply to the thirty-plus million human foetuses your skydaddy gratuitously aborts every year, or the near enough ten million human infants s/he kills for no apparent reason?

    As for the rest of your post, it is fraught with a multitude of errors of omission and commission, but in essence they come down to the fact that your points are only compelling if one already believes as you do, which renders them essentially useless.

    Con-Tester

    April 30, 2009 at 08:43

  39. Johan

    Johan skryf :”As daar NIKS is en ek was verkeerd is ek nogsteeds veilig maar wat van jou as ek reg was?”

    Weet jy hoe graag wil ek hê dat jy reg is . Want as jy reg is gaan daar ‘n Judgement day wees. En daai dag gaan ek vir jou 3 gotte aankla van massamoord , menseslagting , verkragting , verspreiding van vals inligting en profesieë. Moord op kinders , wandade teen die mensdom , mag misbruik , rasse diskriminasie , diskriminasie teen vroue , oorlogsmisdade , vernietiging van privaat eiendom ….

    Ek en Satan gaan jou 3 gotte vir 1000’n jaar in die onblusbare vuur van die hel vasbind saam met al die medepligtiges en simpatiseerders van die jaloerse warlord 3 gotte wat 1 maar 3 is.

    Ek sou reken dat jy maar hoop jy is verkeerd want die vuur van die HEL gaan jou voorland wees.

    DW

    April 30, 2009 at 08:20

  40. Gate, John?

    Suppose we’ve chosen the wrong god. Every time we go to church we’re just making him madder and madder.
    ~ Homer Simpson’s corollary of Pascal’s Wager

    Die punt, John, is dít: Sê nou Zeus is die ware “God”. Of Ushtragyphion van Basgok. Dán gaan jy les opsê op die oordeelsdag.

    Jy glo nie in Z of in Ushi nie!?

    Hoe dúrf jy so ateïsties wees!?

    Eniewei, dis beter om liewer in Z én Ushi te glo… wat kan jy nou verloor? En op die oordeelsdag is jy helemaal ge-cover.

    Nuttin’ beats comprehensive insurance. (Mind – insurance, not assurance.)

    Nathan Bond

    April 30, 2009 at 07:22

  41. het gou ge google maar, Pascal Nathan, klink vir my is ook maar ‘n bietjie “confused” He is contradicting his theory. Sterkte met jou “gamble” op wat Pascal glo oor theism NATHAN, ek sal liewer my vertroue op die bloed van Jesus plaas, geen “gamble” hier nie. Sien, en hier kom nog ‘n man van God se naam wat vir jou brandstof sal wees vir jou haatspraak oor mense wat eintlik NIKS aan jou gedoen het nie, maar Reinhart Bonke het op die vraag “hoekom is daar so baie onverlostes as God almagtig en liefdevol is en Jesus Sy bloed gestort het” sy antwoord was “quote.. why is there so many dirty people when we have such a lot of soap in the world” see by not applying the soap it renders the purpose of the soup useless. It is the same with the blood of Jesus, it is there for all people, it is up to the individual to accept and apply it.
    God gave us a will and that is why He will not make decisions for us, He placed ALL we need for a victorious life here on earth at our disposal, He even gave His son Jesus to die for us. We cause our own difficulties, aids (the atheists like to use to prove God is not love) stop fornicating and being adulterers and aids will stop and so is various other difficulties and calamities.
    God does not have to protect those nonbelievers, and that is the distinct reason why they fell into the things they are in, God is not their God and the god THEY serve is guilty of bringing these calamities over them and will ultimately join him wherever he is, most probably hell.
    Take responsibility for your actions Nathan, and please do not blame God for the state the world is in, man was given dominion over all on the earth and hashed it up, God in all His mercy still let the sun shine on all.
    God can deliver all Nathan; He is not a respecter of persons, He can help with the anger in you, He can deliver you of the resentment you are experiencing. He will gladly wash you too with the blood of Jesus. Nothing you did is too big for God to forgive, HE ACTUALLY LOVES YO NATHAN. No matter what you feel my friend, He loves you and no matter how you are going to react to the following statement I can say I feel compassion for you and wish I can meet with you.
    It take a man to be a Christian Nathan, Mr Angus Buchan’s word is so simple, he propagate, love, deliverance, stability and peace. I have experienced this last year and again this year, my life changed for the good Nathan, I am skeptical about many preachers, yes, but unfortunately there are some preachers that is on a ego trip and full of themselves but they are God’s problem. Me, I make sure I serve God and try to live a life worthy of God and try to let my life be a sermon others can watch and yearn to have it too. Ofcourse I fail form time to time, but that is not God’s fault, IT IS MY OWN, but that does not me bad, I made a mistake but God is gracious and merciful and He forgives me every time and then we walk the road of victory again.
    Why are some people so desperately trying to negate all that the Christians Do?
    What would you say is the answer to the desperate situations we got ourselves into? It it not maybe exactly what Mr Buchan did last week and get so many, intelligent, and men from all walks of life together and urge them to be;
    • The father in their homes again and stop being cowards.
    • Love their wife’s and refrain from extramarital affairs. This causes major instability all over the world.
    • Discipline their children and be a father to them.
    • To not cheat in business and especially on tax returns.
    • To connect with God for guidance.
    • To love people from all walks of life.
    • To refrain from life of racism.
    • Obey the law.
    Can you give me one thing that He, in essence promogated, did or said wrong?
    What is the world doing to better the situations in our country and in the lives of all in the nation?
    Is it maybe war?
    No my friend it is Jesus and Jesus alone?

    Money? What is wrong with the money we had to pay for the excellent organization we found there on Shalom.

    Gearhouse provided and mixed the sound. Excellent lighting, above average stage, Roads were made, water reticulation was in place, ablution for 200000 men and all the services described in our laws for crowds of this magnitude and all for only R150.00. People pay more for rugby games and pop festivals. I hear NO complaints about that. Is it maybe because it is a Christian gathering and now everything must be for free and inferior, it sound so “Christian” to me.

    Nathan please stop judging and building your life on what Christians did wrong, I experienced God in a way nobody can convince me that HE DOES NOT EXIST, I am intelligent and think things through, I am also a successful businessman of 51 years old, I made my share of mistakes in life and I paid dearly for it. I accepted the fact that I was to blame of the calamity I got myself into, repented and am living my life for God, I have experienced both sides and I choose BY FAR the life I am living now.
    See Nathan it is easy not to believe in anything and just do everything we wish to do. But living for Jesus is somewhat challenging but rewarding and ultimately extremely satisfying.

    You are invite to the next MMC conference with me. Nothing will be forced on you but then you can at least give an intellegent and calculated opinion about sonething you attended at least.

    Please do not see this as an attack or me as your enemy, lets meet for coffee and although we have different views about things does not prevent us to be friends.

    John

    April 30, 2009 at 05:50

  42. “Wel ek dank God ONS Hemelse Vader dat hy ons vandag weereens bewaar het en nou kan ek die aand saam met my vrou en kinders deurbring en natuurlik bietjie met julle gesels.”

    ‘n Opregte vraag aan jou, John: Sou daar die dag iets verkeerd gaan, bv God het jou of jou gesin die dag nie bewaar nie (en ek hoop nie dis die geval nie), wat gaan dan die verduideliking wees? Sal dit wees omdat jy of jou gesien te veel gesondig het, of dalk omdat God jou wou wys wie is baas, ‘n tipe van n reality check?

    Ek hoor graag van jou.

    rick

    Rick

    April 30, 2009 at 05:21

  43. John

    Dis vir my skokkend hoe gereeld die argument “wat as ek reg is en jy is verkeerd” opduik.

    Glo jy werklik in God ‘to save your arse?”…soos Bill Maher vir die een ou in Religulous gevra het.

    Rick

    Rick

    April 30, 2009 at 05:09

  44. Maar wys dan vir ons die gate Nathan Bond, ek is heel bewus vandie feit dat dit ‘n oue is, maar die gate, wel …. ek twyfel

    John

    April 30, 2009 at 04:15

  45. John skryf (April 29, 2009 om 6:24 nm):

    daar is welliswaar ‘n waarskuwing [vir] julle en dit is dat julle moet oppas want … die God van Hemel en aarde laat hom nie bespot nie. dit SAL julle ongelukkig op ‘n baie erge manier agterkom…

    Die hele basis van jou bestaan is dus ’n groot en kinderagtige bangmaak storie. Sien, ek laat my nie só intimideer nie. Jy kan maar vir jou hemelse afknouer sê dat ek sal begin respek toon sodra h/sy begin goed regmaak wat h/sy self in die eerste plek opgefok het.

    Con-Tester

    April 29, 2009 at 21:09

  46. Al van Pascal’s Wager gehoor, John? Hierdie kak argument van jou is ‘n oue en het meer gate as ‘n sif.

    Nathan Bond

    April 29, 2009 at 20:21

  47. DW,
    Net nuuskierig, wat ek aflei van jou stelling is dat jy dink 70% van die bevolking is Christene, reg? ek is nie seker nie maar ek dink dan die ander 29% is van ander gelowe en “1%” glo daar is NIKS, ek wonder hoekom, is ek reg? Net gewonder.
    As daar NIKS is en ek was verkeerd is ek nogsteeds veilig maar wat van jou as ek reg was?

    John

    April 29, 2009 at 18:38

  48. Dagsê manne en vroue,
    Wat ‘n heerlike dag, nou net klaar “gegym” en voel goed. wel ek het bietjie tyd, ek sien daar is nog ‘n paar aanvalle. It reminds me “sticks and stones” vir die met verstand sal dit iets beteken. Wel ek dank God ONS Hemelse Vader dat hy ons vandag weereens bewaar het en nou kan ek die aand saam met my vrou en kinders deurbring en natuurlik bietjie met julle gesels.
    daar is welliswaar ‘n waarskuwing wat ek sal moet uitstuur na julle en dit is dat julle moet oppas want dit is ok as julle my of al die ander “Christene” uitskel, dit doen aan my absoluut niks maar die God van Hemel en aarde laat hom nie bespot nie. dit SAL julle ongelukkig op ‘n baie erge manier agterkom and manne en vroue wat nie vir Jesus Christus aangeneem het as hulle saligmaker en aanvaar het dat Hy vir ons aan die kruis gesterf het nie, gaan binnekort baie ontnugter in die hel wakker word saam met satan wat in elk geval NIKS vir jou of enige iemand anders omgee nie. die ys wat julle op loop is dun vriende en al breek die ys gaan dit jou niks help nie. Die hel is warm en het nogal ‘n neiging om die ys wat julle dink julle beskerm te smelt. ek hou maar aan vir julle bid,

    John 3:16
    For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

    JESUS IS KONING

    John

    April 29, 2009 at 18:24

  49. Johan skryf:”Quote:” Dr Isak Burger en Mr Angus Buchan is altwee persone vir wie ek onsaglike repspek het en ek verseker nie sal durf waag om met hulle te spot nie, hulle is waardige gesante van God”

    Kak man , 70 % van die bevolking is Christene .
    Baie goed dat jy Izak en Anus Angus in die selfde asem noem. Jy het net vergeet om vir Benny Hinn ook saam met die kakpraat kamerade te noem.

    Hoe lank dink jy gaan dit vat voordat Angus by Benny Hinn gaan oorvat as die nr.1 geloofsgeneesheer?

    Gemeet aan sy onlangse “sukses” – (prys die jirrrrre )het hy al klaar sy moves gemaak.

    DW

    April 28, 2009 at 15:35

  50. Quote:”C’mon Agnes – at least a Beechcraft Baron?”

    No , not a Baron , he is flying around in helicopters like the other day at Nampo with his Bible Belt American mentor.

    DW

    April 28, 2009 at 15:25

  51. John skryf (April 28, 2009 om 10:32 vm):

    Al die atieste, dis maklik om ‘n aties te wees maar dit van ‘n man om ‘n Christen te wees.

    Nee, dit vat ’n breingespoelde en benullose moroon om geloof, insluitende die Gristelike ene, onkrities en ernstig op te vat. Ongelukkig is sulkes vêr in die meerderheid.

    Con-Tester

    April 28, 2009 at 15:10

  52. Say the man that has not been there, what does he know? It was not R100 per ticket but R150 so its even more, that accounts for much more!

    Oom Angus did not aim or try to get 200 000 men together but he succeeded, 200 000 men who knows what it means to live!

    You do the math, 8km of water pipes, 330 000 litres of water per hour, 980kVA of electricity at any given time, a sound system close to R3 000 000, seating for 200 000 men and the lands used from all the surrounding areas. Land that was supposed to be full of mielies. You do the math what it will cost to house 200 000 men for 4 days.

    And still Oom Angus lives in his old little mud house with an ordinary car.

    Jeane- Pierre Tollemache

    April 28, 2009 at 14:12

  53. John

    ‘n Mens kan nie respek hê vir beide die Bybel, aan die een kant en Izak Burger en Angus Buchan, aan die ander kant, nie.

    Wie ook al die Bybel respekteer moet met veragting kyk hoe Burger en Buchan die Bybel verkrag.

    Al die komedie gesien – Faith like potatoes?

    Al die komedie gelees – Vyf minute na die dood?

    Nathan Bond

    April 28, 2009 at 14:12

  54. Gelowiges is blatant onnosel. Hulle redenasie is soos volg: “Die bybel bewys god se bestaan. God se bestaan bewys die bybel.”

    Ek self glo in Alfred E. Neuman. Hoekom? Want die Mad tydskrif bewys Alfred E. Neuman se bestaan. En Alfred E. Neuman se bestaan bewys Mad tydskrif. En siedaar: AlfredEse Neumanisme!

    Nou, gaan kry vir julle ’n nuwe argument want hierdie ene het al lankal begin stink van die vrot. As julle nie kan sien wat darmee verkeerd is nie dan gaan kry vir julle ’n nuwe brein, hoor?

    Con-Tester

    April 28, 2009 at 12:42

  55. Jammer was nie klaar nie, Wil net se dat diegene wat so gekant is teen God my opgewonde maak omdat ek weet dat mense wat so bevrees is vir iets of iemand dat hulle ure sal spandeer om te bewys dat Hy nie bestaan nie aan my die bewys is dat Hy wel bestaan and wel sal kom om sy bruid te kom haal.Aan die spotters kan ek wel se dat ek julle baie jammer kry en vit julle sal bid. ek wil nie in julle skoene staan die dag as jy hierdie lewe met die ewige verwissel om die God of god wat jy gedien het te ontmoet nie. die geen god gelowiges sal wel hul geen god ontmoet en glo my hy voel net swo niks vir jou as wat jy glo hy is niks nie. die probleem is net dat hy wel is en die mag het om jou te pynig vir die res van jou lewe. so my vriend dis my beskeie opinie. diegene soos Dr Isak Burger en Mr Angus Buchan is altwee persone vir wie ek onsaglike repspek het en ek verseker nie sal durf waag om met hulle te spot nie, hulle is waardige gesante van God. Al die atieste, dis maklik om ‘n aties te wees maar dit van ‘n man om ‘n Christen te wees. ek sal my nie begewe in enige dialoog oor wat reg en verkeerd is nie. Ek het regtig nie die tyd nie, ek het God beleef an leef vir Hom, my familie leef vir Hom, and we have a ball man, we do all the things the “athiests do” just without the sin attached to it. we do not booze or any intoxicating substance to be ourselves and we certainly do not satan ar no satan, all we need is God. He has never let us down and never wil. once yu have tasted the goodness of Jesus there is no turning back man. just try it, maybe go visit the man of God, Dr Isak Burger. you might just change from this empty life you are so desperately trying to defend by attacing other people that in essense did nothing to you but helped once lost guys like me to live a victirious life in Christ. I pray for you my friend that is a promise.

    John

    April 28, 2009 at 10:32

  56. Al die “atieste” en Christene,
    Daar is twee goed wat mens nie oor stry nie, en dit is Godsdiens en politiek.
    Almal is geregtig op ‘n mening maar oor die internet gaan jy niemand oortuig van enige iets nie. Ons staan in elk geval nie ‘n kans om iemand wat so gekant is teen die skepper van die hemel en die aarde en glo dat die mensdom van ape afkomstig is nie. van die argumente mag dalk die teorie staaf.
    so in kort God is die Alpha en Omega. Hy is die begin en die einde, Hy is wonderbaar, raadsman Sterke God en ewige

    John

    April 28, 2009 at 10:13

  57. Doppies

    Jy sê: “… so gaan jy in elke kerk dinge kry waarvan jy nie hou nie.”

    Tja – soos “God”.

    Nathan Bond

    April 28, 2009 at 06:30

  58. Ek is nie ‘n ds of oppad om een te word nie. Ek is iemand wat self getwyfel het oor die geloof en het self baie vrae gehad. Ja ek is my hele lewe nog in die dopper kerk, maar dit beteken niks nie. Daar is dinge waarmee ek nie saamstem in die kerk nie en daar is dinge wat ek dink bevraagteken moet word, maar dit is nie dinge wat gaan maak of ek gered word of nie en so gaan jy in elke kerk dinge kry waarvan jy nie hou nie.

    dopper student

    April 28, 2009 at 00:39

  59. Soos ek van die begin af gesê het, jy kan die geloofskrif van jou keuse raadpleeg, maar jy moet vir jouself onderskeid tref tussen wat die waarheid is en wat nie die waarheid is nie.
    Is julle so teen alle gelowe of net die Christen? Indien julle wel net teen die Christen so is, sou ek graag wou weet hoekom, dit is tog die geloof wat sê ons moet mekaar liefhê… iets fout daarmee (hang seke af wat jy verstaan onder liefde)!!
    Ek gaan niemand probeer oortuig om te glo in wat ek glo nie, maar die feit dat almal so teen die geloof is beteken dat julle tog daaraan dink en as dit nie ‘n probleem was nie, hoekom pla dit julle so, hoekom gaan julle nie net aan met jul lewens en los die wat wil glo dat hulle glo warin hulle wil nie?
    Die punt wat ek maak is dat dit nie saakmaak wat ek of enige iemand anders van die Bybel (of ‘n bybel) dink nie, jy moet jou eie besluit maak. As jy sukkel om jou besluit te regverdig, dan moet jy inligting opsoek en kry en sodat jy dan ‘n rede het vir jou besluit.
    Ek sal bly wees as julle tot bekering wil kom, maar gaan nie my nek breuk om julle te oortuig nie, al wat ek kan doen is om julle in die rigting te wys wat ek as die waarheid ken en vandaar is dit in God se hand en jou keuse. Ek daag julle uit om voor julle die Bybel afkraak die skrywers se geskiedenis te gaan opsoek en te kyk hoeveel hulle van mekaar geweet het en die waarheid agter hoe die skrif ontstaan het te kry.
    As hierdie hele geloof ding jou pla beteken dit dat iets nie reg is nie. So as jy dan nie wil aanvaar dat die Bybel die waarheid is nie, gaan soek elke dingetjie daarin op tot op die fynste detail en kyk of jy een enkele leuen darin kan kry. As jou bevindinge nie iets vir jou beteken nie, gaan lees ander gelowe se bybels, ontleed dit en kyk of jy leuens of fasheid darin kry. As jy nie die moeite wil doen om agter die waarheid te kom nie, moet jy maar vrede maak met die besluit wat jy gemaak het en dit daar los!!

    dopper student

    April 28, 2009 at 00:29

  60. Dopper Student

    Jy is nog ‘n snotkop wat in die kankerkamer van dopper indoktrinasie sit. Ek weet jy ervaar ‘n goddelike ereksie elke keer as jou ma van haar dopper ds. seun praat.

    Jy is niks anders as ‘n huigelaar ,‘n skynheilige sot wat valsheid as die waarheid opdis. Ek vrees as ek daaraan dink hoeveel mense nog onder jou geïnstitusionaliseerde drek gaan deurloop, om nie eers aan onskuldige kinders te dink wat deur jou snert bedwelmd gaan word .

    Elke keer as jy ‘n ereksie kry as jy aan jou 3 gotte dink , dink aan die woorde……they must find it difficult, those who have taken authority as the truth, rather than truth as the authority” … G. Massey

    DW

    April 27, 2009 at 11:06

  61. Doppies

    Lees Sir Arthur Conan Doyle en wéét dat Sherlock Holmes lééf!

    Nathan Bond

    April 27, 2009 at 08:42

  62. Ek het probeer om te lees wat jy geskryf het, maar ongelukkig het my brein ‘n paar keer probeer “reboot”. Dit is jou stelling “Ek raai aan dat as jy werklik wil weet of God bestaan dan moet jy by die Bybel begin.” wat die probleem veroorsaak het.

    Jammer, nog ‘n “reboot”. Sjoe, die model wat ek het kan nie hierdie dogma verwerk nie. So, as ek jou reg verstaan as ek wil weet of die Church of Scientology reg is moet ek Hubbard se “bybel” bestudeer. Maak 100% sin. Wat kan ek daarop antwoord behalwe dat jy ‘n intelektuele reus is!

    Pikkewyn

    April 26, 2009 at 18:38

  63. Dopper student

    Jy reken: “Die Bybel is die enigste boek wat oor ‘n lang tydperk geskryf is deur verskillende mense en elkeen verkondig dieselfde boodskap.”

    Gaan lees weer, en gaan lees mooi. Bloot die feit dat die karakter van Jesus n geleende karakter is van gode soos Mitra en Krishna, behoort jou te laat wonder oor die betroubaarheid en oorspronklikheid van die Bybel.

    Wat die profesieë aanbetref. Die ‘vervulling’ van die profesieë het natuurlik plaasgevind na die aanvanklike beloftes gemaak is. Dus, n klomp subjektiewe outeurs met een moerse agenda om hul boek van die grond af te kry het die Ou Testament se legkaart voltooi. Het jy dit al oorweeg?

    rick

    Rick

    April 26, 2009 at 15:48

  64. Aan almal wat God bevraagteken…

    Ek raai aan dat as jy werklik wil weet of God bestaan dan moet jy by die Bybel begin. As jy nie omgee of God bestaan of nie, dan los dìe wat wel in God glo in vrede en gaan aan met jou lewe maar moet dan nie uitspraak lewer en sê dìe wat in God glo, glo ‘n leuen nie, want om dit te doen moet jy eers ondersoek instel en seker maak dat wat jy van oortuig is, is die waarheid.

    Ek is seker dat as julle die moeite doen om die geskiedenis te gaan opsoek (en in credible bronne, nie net die internet nie), dan sal julle vind dat die Bybel absoluut waarheid is. Die Bybel is die enigste boek wat oor ‘n lang tydperk geskryf is deur verskillende mense en elkeen verkondig dieselfde boodskap. As mens mooi daaroor (en al die ander aspekte van die Bybel) dink dan sal jy besef dit is onmoontlik vir ‘n mens om so iets uit homself te skep. As bloot net die geskiedenis en profesieë in die Bybel as waarheid bewys kan word, dan moet mens jouself die vraag vra of die ander askpekte van die Bybel nie dalk ook die waarheid is nie… jy moet darem baie naive wees om te dink dat als in die Bybel waar is, behalwe die dele wat na God verwys.
    Die groot fout wat mense soms maak is om kerke en christene aan te vat terwyl ons net mense is met foute van ons eie. Ek verwys na DW se stelling oor die nagmaal bv: Het jy gekyk na wat die Bybel oor die nagmaal sê in plaas om net te glo wat die kerk sê. Ek het begrip daarvoor as mense vir instansies soos kerke en Christen groepe kwaad raak oor wat hulle belei, maar jy moet jouself die vraag vra of jy daarmee saamstem en op een of ander manier dit vir jouself regverdig. As ‘n ander persoon vir my sê ek gaan hel toe, dan het ek vrede daarmee, ek ondersoek my eie saak en hou by die waarheid van Christus. Op die ouend sal ons elkeen voor God se oordeel staan en die enigste manier warop ek my saak kan regverdig is deur Jesus Christus as my verlosser te aanvaar. So wat bly oor?… Jy moet besluit of jy in God glo of nie. So as jy sou belangstel, waar begin jy?…

    As jy die waarheid oor God wil weet dan moet jy eerstens die Bybel raadpleeg (en as jy nie weet watse bybel om raad te pleeg nie, dan kan jy elkeen raadpleeg, toets teen die geskiedenis en dan sal jy met slegs een oorbly). As jy my woord sal aanvaar as die waarheid, koop dan “Die Bybel in Praktyk” (ek stel dit voor omdat dit beskrywende stukke insluit as mens die teks nie altyd opslag begryp nie). Die belangrike ding as jy die Bybel lees is om dit binne konteks te verstaan en nie die boodskap darin te verdraai soos jy wil nie (ek weet kerke doen partykeer juis dit en christene ook).

    Op die ouend van die dag het ons elkeen ‘n keuse. Vat ons die Bybel vir wat dit is of verdraai ons dit om te wees wat ons wil hê dit moet wees. Aanvaar jy die waarheid wat in die Bybel opgeskryf is of verwerp jy dit en uiteindellik bly jy oor met een keuse, glo in die drie-enige God en Jesus Christus as jou enigste verlosser of verwerp dit. God verhard wie Hy wil, ek is nie een om te oordeel nie, maar wat ek wel kan sê is dat ons elkeen ‘n keuse het in wat ons glo en is self daarvoor aanspreeklik.

    dopper student

    April 25, 2009 at 23:23

  65. Dankie vir jou antwoord, DW.

    Daan Van der Merwe

    April 20, 2009 at 08:43

  66. Hans Matthysen skryf (April 16, 2009 at 10:00 pm):

    Con-tester, ek moet toegee, dat daar is ongelukkig “sogenaamde Christene” wat woorde wil gebruik asof hulle beteken net wat hulle wil hê dit moet.

    Ja. Probleem is, dis omtrent almal van hulle.

    Hans Matthysen skryf (April 16, 2009 at 10:00 pm):

    Die man het gebid en die reën het geval, so what, niks om oor suur te raak nie.

    Ja, presies – g’n enkele rede om te glo dat gebed wel reën versorg het. Nou hoekom wil jy ’n groot storie daaruit pers?

    Hans Matthysen skryf (April 16, 2009 at 10:00 pm):

    My gebed vir die vigs probleem is, lei ‘n skoon lewe en dan is die probleem opgelos.

    Maar dit gee niks hulp aan die bestaande vigs-wesies nie. Hulle het rêrig jou hemel-pappa se aandag nodig.

    Hans Matthysen skryf (April 16, 2009 at 10:00 pm):

    Ek lei nie aan ‘n siem-sala-miem sindroom nie.

    Lekker ou grappie, dié!

    Hans Matthysen skryf (April 16, 2009 at 10:00 pm):

    Die kennis van God is gewoonlik dwaasheid by die mens wat op sy eie kennis wil staat maak.

    Nóg misbruik van daai woordjie “kennis.”

    Hans Matthysen skryf (April 16, 2009 at 10:00 pm):

    Jy is een wat op ander sal trap as hulle die vrugte van die gees aan jou openbaar omdat jy dit as ‘n swakheid beskou…

    Jy weet, toe ek so jare gelede in die weermag was, het ons bevelvoerder, ’n majoor, ’n gesegde gehad wat hy dikwels en gereeld geuiter het. Dit het soos volg gelui: “Aaag kák, man!” Ek trap op enige dom etter wat weier om sy brein in te span.

    Hans Matthysen skryf (April 16, 2009 at 10:00 pm):

    … en daarom is die “oog vir ‘n oog en tand vir ‘n tand” houding van toepassing.

    Weereens: “Aaag kák, man!”

    Hans Matthysen skryf (April 16, 2009 at 10:00 pm):

    My verwysing is die Bybel en my, let wel my en nie jou bewyse is wat ek ervaar en weet.

    Lekker man. Nou toe, gaan stenig ’n paar ongehoorsame kinders, nes jou bybel dit vir jou beveel.

    Con-Tester

    April 18, 2009 at 00:46

  67. ALLE , predikante ?

    Jy weet ou Daan , ek het al met baie predikante gepraat. Daar is een van hulle wat ek regtig mee simpatie het. Maar vir die res voel ek fokkol, hulle is kakpraters en hulle weet dit.
    11 jaar gelede vertel ‘n dopper predikant my hy dat hy 95 % saam met my stem. Nou watse kak is dit. Wil jy sê ons verskil net 5 % . Gods Daan , ek en jy verskil 100 % met mekaar oor die gotte , ek en foking Johannes verskil 100 % , ek en Hans verskil 100 % met mekaar. Ek en die foking Pous verskil 100 % met mekaar .
    Maar die foking Dopper is ‘n donderse fundamentalis wat glo dit is ‘n dwaalleer om nagmaal uit kelkies te drink , en dat Cloete se beryming van die duiwel af is. As ons net 5 % verskil het kon ek die Pous gewees het.
    Alle predikante twyfel en het ook nie antwoorde . Daar is nie een wat bereid is jou vra op skrif te beantwoord nie. Vra vir Nathan hy sal kan beaam wat ek sê .
    Ja natuurlik daar is van die ooms wat glo dat hulle gesante van “God “en is godsgeroepe is . Dit is hoofsaaklik die geslag wat nou op pensioen gaan of wat al afgetree moes gewees het. Dit is hulle wat voor die elektroniese tyd die grootste deel van hulle lewe voltooi het . Maar vir ‘n middeljarige man ,in die tyd van elektronika en tegnologie , wat inligting net ‘n druk van ‘n knoppie weg het , is daar geen verskoning nie . Daan daar is geen verskoning vir jou om in KAK te glo nie.
    Het jy al die kak wat jy glo gaan toets of is jy soos ‘n Moslem en Adventis wat dit nie mag doen nie? Of is jy soos Johannes wat heeltemal geïndoktrineerde is wat geen foking brein meer oor het nie

    Bv , op Google binne 0.03 sekondes – as jy The Pope indruk is daar meer as 16 miljoen hits .
    Of , controversies in the bible – binne 0.17 sekondes is daar meer as ‘n miljoen hits.
    Of , God is a killer – binne 0.19 sekondes 33 miljoen hits .
    Hoekom is die mensdom nog so verslaaf aan kak as hy kan lees en skryf ?
    Hoekom glo jy en Johannes en Hans in KAK , kan julle regtig nie lees en verstaan nie of het julle matriek in die dom-baan voltooi ?

    DW

    April 17, 2009 at 18:57

  68. DW! More.

    Is jy nie ‘n bietjie onredelik nie?

    Die kerk van die Calvinisme verkondig dat:

    1. ‘n Mens God nie mag versoek nie;

    2. God nie wil hê ons moet WEET (kennis) Hy bestaan nie. Hy wil hê ons moet GLO (kennis EN vertroue);

    Jesus het in elk geval gedurende Sy leeftyd gesê dat daar geen verdere tekens anders as die teken van Jona sal wees nie.

    Wat ek graag wil weet is glo jy ALLE predikante praat kak en hulle weet dit, maar verkondig nog steeds geloof waarin hulle self nie glo nie?

    Daan Van der Merwe

    April 17, 2009 at 10:51

  69. Con-tester, ek moet toegee, dat daar is ongelukkig “sogenaamde Christene” wat woorde wil gebruik asof hulle beteken net wat hulle wil hê dit moet. Die man het gebid en die reën het geval, so what, niks om oor suur te raak nie.

    My gebed vir die vigs probleem is, lei ‘n skoon lewe en dan is die probleem opgelos. Ek lei nie aan ‘n siem-sala-miem sindroom nie.

    Die kennis van God is gewoonlik dwaasheid by die mens wat op sy eie kennis wil staat maak.

    Jy is een wat op ander sal trap as hulle die vrugte van die gees aan jou openbaar omdat jy dit as ‘n swakheid beskou en daarom is die “oog vir ‘n oog en tand vir ‘n tand” houding van toepassing. Gelukkig het ek ook ‘n gees van onderskeiding. My verwysing is die Bybel en my, let wel my en nie jou bewyse is wat ek ervaar en weet.

    Hans Matthysen

    April 16, 2009 at 22:00

  70. Hans Matthysen skryf (April 15, 2009 at 9:29 pm):

    Con-tester, ek sien geen verdraaing in wat ek geskryf het en miskien sal dit gaaf wees as jy die sogenaamde verdraaing vir ons sal uitwys.

    Dit is as gevolg van die feit dat julle Gristene woorde wil gebruik asof hulle beteken net wat julle wil hê dit moet. Jou belaglike implikasie is dat die reëngebed gewerk het en dat ons goddelose ketters en heidene geen antwoord daarop het nie, en sê dan dat ons ongelukkig is oor dat iemand só sal bid. Gebruik jou kop, man, want jy’s omtrent so vêr van die punt af as wat dit moontlik is om te wees! In tussentyd, en weereens, bid tog asb. vir ons ’n groot verligting vir Afrika se vigs-weesies in die werklikheid in.

    Asseblief man. Dankie. Dan sal ek jou perdalkies ’n bietjie meer ernstig opvat.

    Hans Matthysen skryf (April 15, 2009 at 9:29 pm):

    Jou kennis is beperk tot dit wat aards en fiesies is en wat ek weet, ervaar en kennis van het, sal jy tog nie kan uitwis nie. Gelukkig is jou beperkte kennis nie die alfa en die omega nie.

    Ja, wragtig. Want al die snert wat jy my wil wysmaak is nie “kennis” nie, soos ek al baie kere vir jou verduidelik het.

    Hans Matthysen skryf (April 15, 2009 at 9:29 pm):

    Julle ateïste sê wat julle wil en daarom sê ons Christenne ook somtyds wat ons wil.

    So die een regverdig die ander, of hoe? Dit is ’n lekker Gristelike houding, hoor! In elk geval, julle Gristene sê heeltyd, sonder oplet, net dit wat julle wil, sonder enige verwysing na bewysbare feite toe.

    Con-Tester

    April 16, 2009 at 09:15

  71. Daan

    Almal is bulshitters, die graad van bulshit is al waaroor ons kan stry.
    Die dag as iemand vir my ‘n altaar aan die band kan bid , net soos Elia gedoen het sal ek my woorde terugtrek.

    DW

    April 16, 2009 at 07:42

  72. Con-tester, ek sien geen verdraaing in wat ek geskryf het en miskien sal dit gaaf wees as jy die sogenaamde verdraaing vir ons sal uitwys?
    Jou kennis is beperk tot dit wat aards en fiesies is en wat ek weet, ervaar en kennis van het, sal jy tog nie kan uitwis nie. Gelukkig is jou beperkte kennis nie die alfa en die omega nie.
    Julle ateïste sê wat julle wil en daarom sê ons Christenne ook somtyds wat ons wil.

    Hans Matthysen

    April 15, 2009 at 21:29

  73. DW! More.

    Dink jy dis moontlik dat ALLE predikante die Christelike geloof verkondig terwyl hulle dit self nie glo nie?

    Dat almal ‘n klomp bullshitters soos Angus en Benny is?

    Angus en Benny is skatryk, maar ek ken BAIE predikante wie niks geld het nie.

    Daan Van der Merwe

    April 15, 2009 at 09:58

  74. LauraLee skryf:”Vannaand sal ek my hart van liefde stort aan elke mense wat nog nie die liefde van God op een of ander wyse konkreet aanvaar het nie..”

    Hi daar

    Jy praat van die liefde van God. Geld dit ook vir gelowiges wat nie vir Jesus erken nie?

    (Met ander woorde vir meer as 4.5 triljoen nie Christene)

    Jy het ook seker ‘n foto van Angus in jou wallet en al sy DVD’s en aartappel boeke , om nie eers van Isak Burger se boeke te praat nie.
    http://jv.news24.com/Beeld/Opinie/Briewe/0,,3-2085-73_2500337,00.html

    DW

    April 14, 2009 at 08:46

  75. Ag ja, LauraLee, julle gelowiges praat altyd met sulke oortuiging oor julle “kennis” en alles wat julle oor julle god “weet” en kan “sien.” Maar julle verkrag die woorde “kennis” en “wete” en “sien” sommer gou-gou en sonder enige gewetensknaging want aan die einde van die dag het julle niks om julle bewerings mee te staaf nie. “Dit is só omdat ek sê dis só! Ek wys vir jou ’n ou boek.” Einde van argument.

    Net een ding verbaas my so effens. As jy so seker is van jou saak, hoekom so hewig probeer om ons ateïste te tug? Is dit dalk omdat ons jou omkrap, “WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT”!?

    Con-Tester

    April 13, 2009 at 21:40

  76. Julle mans is almal ewe verveeld….Wat my tref is hoedat Nathan (kampvegter vir enige iets wat teen God ingaan…soveel tyd aan iets kan spandeer waarin hy nie glo nie).
    Wel as jy nou vannaand weereens jou hele dag gespandeer het om die wereld te oortuig dat daar nie ‘n God bestaan nie, jy ‘n duisend wee geloop het om almal wat reeds God in al Sy vorm, groot klein, sigbaar of onsigbaar beleef het…graag anders wil oortuig….Hoekom begin jy nie eerder ‘n forum wat niks met God te doen het nie, want regtig ek dink nie jou insette raak hom nie…Anders as wat jy dink is jy net nog een swaeltjie en werklik vannaand as ek stil lang my kind kniel haar weerloosheid beleef my eie onvermoe om enige iets wat dalk met haar mag gebeur kan keer….sal ek steeds bid vir God …en weet ongeag….in my wereld is Hy nie ‘n fairy tale nie…en in my wereld sal self ek klein genoeg kan word om die grootheid van God in alles en almal om my te sien….Jou probleem is jy is so besig met jou eie beperkte denke en vrese dat jy nog nooit gaan stil sit en gedink het …sou ek dalk besef hoeveel goed ek nie verstaan nie…nou wil jy God inbox en probeer in lyne laat pas….Vannaand sal ek my hart van liefde stort aan elke mense wat nog nie die liefde van God op een of ander wyse konkreet aanvaar het nie..En vir elke man wat hier vir God ‘n lansie breek sonder die backup van die wetenskap….’n Man met sy hande omhoog besig om God te eer….is ‘n man…Rustige nag vir jou Nathan…selfs oor jou sal God se seen wees vannaand “WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT”!!

    LauraLee

    April 13, 2009 at 17:12

  77. As jy vir reen bid sal die 3 gotte dit ook in die woestyn laat reen wat laas voor die ystydperk reen gehad het?

    Wat van julle bid vir my ‘n altaar aan die brand ? Net soos in die tyd van Elia. Toeman !!!!!

    DW

    April 9, 2009 at 15:31

  78. Ag Hans Matthysen, verdraai dit nes jy wil, maar bid tog asb. vir ons ’n groot verligting vir Afrika se vigs-weesies in die werklikheid in.

    Asseblief man. Dankie.

    Con-Tester

    April 9, 2009 at 08:52

  79. Johan, daar is nog geen reaksie oor jou komentaar en dit blyk, dat hulle nog besig is om die weerkaarte van daardie tyd, te bestudeer. Ek weet nie hoekom is hulle so ongelukkig oordat iemand vir reën bid.

    Hans Matthysen

    April 8, 2009 at 20:58

  80. jy weet, dit het toe actually nogal gereën, come to think of it…

    moet die engels wees.

    Johan Swarts

    February 13, 2009 at 14:50

  81. Hy is vals. Hy praat Engels wat die duiwel se taal is so bly maar weg van hom.

    Vaktap

    February 12, 2009 at 15:57

  82. Something else: “I’se a-gonna pray for rain in the Eastern Cape this Friday . . ”

    THIS FRIDAY!! WHY!? f’f’ck’sake?
    Why not NOW?
    “Lissen my connection: Rain! 25mm. Eastern Cape. Now. Thanks. Over & out.” “Um, make it widespread. Over”.

    Why wait till Friday?
    Is it somehow connected to the same reason you have to trek to a farm outside Greytown in your diesel bakkie or your Toyota Corolla to pray? Can’t just connect wherever you are and make it happen?
    Almighty, All-knowing, Ever-present, remember? Omnipotent, Omniscient, Omnipresent.

    Sounds more like R100 a head at the gate to me. And television coverage. And pass the plate around in the big top – erm, marquee.

    bewilderbeast

    February 12, 2009 at 00:01

  83. Or even a groo-oot flood, like Biblical, y’know. Have you seen the Creationists, I mean Intelligent Designers, are now catching a bit of science (sort of) and re-inventing themselves again?

    And have you seen Old Agnes Buchan is aiming to gather 200 000 mighty men on his plaas this year? At one hundred bucks a head. You do the math.

    Good theatre. Last time an oke had a heart attack in the big marquee and G-D picked up the red hotline phone, enabling Agnes to shout “Jee-sus just told me not to worry – he’s going to be alright”. When the poor fella expired away, Agnes announced “I’ve just heard: he’s with Jee-sus”!

    And these mighty men shout “Hallelujah, Agnes! You’re not a charlatan and a liar! No! You’re a Chosen One with a direct connection to GOD. It’s like a government contract with the Prisons, only it pays better! Hallelujah! Ay-men, brother.”

    And pass the loot.

    BTW: Which American gang is Agnes aligned with? I bet he is aligned with one of the US gangs.

    And: (I ramble on, trim where you must): There was an old Sangoma in Nqutu near Dundee who had his own Dakota and pilot – the better to fly around and tend to his flock (dead now – even his muti had its limitations).
    C’mon Agnes – at least a Beechcraft Baron?

    bewilderbeast

    February 11, 2009 at 22:53

  84. Auke

    Great to see you here on the blog! Hope to read much more from you.

    Nathan Bond

    February 6, 2009 at 19:05

  85. The problem with praying for rain is that the faithful should also specify more or less how much rain they want. After all, Baby Jesus has only a vague grasp of meteorology and may accidentally flash-flood the faithful. Its hard being all-powerful and merciful, hey.

    Auke Slotegraaf

    February 6, 2009 at 17:31


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